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Author Topic: WSD Mini-Series-How was it?  (Read 2034 times)

Offline Acacia Heartstrings

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Re: WSD Mini-Series-How was it?
« Reply #15 on: December 28, 2018, 10:14:01 PM »
Oh yeah I saw that, going to watch that review tonight.

The models certainly had me skeptical, but the dialogue and voice acting in this series were so breathtaking, it more than made up for what the visuals lacked.

totally agree with you friend rabbit. Even so I think that the animation is quite competent, with beautiful scenarios. It has many changes, but in general it seems to me a good adaptation with the essence of Watership Down.    :fiver 
I love it 100%. I could die in peace after seeing it.
It's already on sale, somewhere friends ?????        :hannah2
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Offline CockatielPony

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Re: WSD Mini-Series-How was it?
« Reply #16 on: December 28, 2018, 11:27:33 PM »
Campion1, I did watch some of that video, but stopped shortly after they started complaining about Bigwig's grumpy character.
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Offline Chipster-roo

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Re: WSD Mini-Series-How was it?
« Reply #17 on: December 29, 2018, 12:23:53 AM »
It's already on sale, somewhere friends ?????        :hannah2
I'm afraid the miniseries hasn't been released on DVD yet :( The picture book and colouring book are still available though.
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Offline CockatielPony

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Re: WSD Mini-Series-How was it?
« Reply #18 on: December 29, 2018, 06:18:05 AM »
I notice that the ratings have been going up for IMDb, IGN and Rotten tomatoes.
Right now they are at
IMDb: 7.1/10
Ign: 7.5/10
RT: 71%
When I first checked them they where about at the 60% range. I'm so glad Watership down is getting more attention.  :D
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Offline MeadowRabbit

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Re: WSD Mini-Series-How was it?
« Reply #19 on: December 31, 2018, 12:13:37 AM »
Have watched it all now. :0

I'm actually not overly sure what to make of it. I quite liked the first two episodes but the last two gave me more mixed feelings.

Spoiler: ShowHide
Not a fan of Hazel dying so soon. Kind of made it seem like he didn't really do all that much to be chief. Point was that he lived agesss for a rabbit and really earned out his chief status. Not a fan!!!
« Last Edit: December 31, 2018, 02:39:29 PM by MeadowRabbit »
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Offline MeadowRabbit

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Re: WSD Mini-Series-How was it?
« Reply #20 on: December 31, 2018, 12:22:54 AM »
I don't think I'm in a hurry to watch the series again soon. But that's not to say I won't ever! I probably will in a few years. :D

I don't want people to think I'm just sprouting negative thoughts again, haha! There were some nice parts but I just have to remember them again. :) Such thoughts will hopefully come out in various threads!

Spoiler: ShowHide
I think the film was actually still closer to the book than the series in a way. They deviated away more than I thought.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2018, 02:41:45 PM by MeadowRabbit »
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Offline Hammy

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Re: WSD Mini-Series-How was it?
« Reply #21 on: December 31, 2018, 12:24:06 AM »
Again, entirely fair. I think it was overall okay, but there's a lot to pick at.

Spoiler: ShowHide

Oh, yeah, absolutely true. The miniseries has a lot of odd, often arbitrary changes to distinguish itself.

Clover. Just- Clover.
Bunny black hole. Of character.

Offline MeadowRabbit

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Re: WSD Mini-Series-How was it?
« Reply #22 on: December 31, 2018, 12:25:04 AM »
Spoiler: ShowHide
Ha, yeah. I quite liked her design... but yes, she took over a tad... You're right that she helped make Hyzenthlay a weak character. And Thuthinn... however it's spelt barely got a look in!
« Last Edit: December 31, 2018, 02:43:38 PM by MeadowRabbit »
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Offline Hammy

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Re: WSD Mini-Series-How was it?
« Reply #23 on: December 31, 2018, 12:26:39 AM »
Spoiler: ShowHide
God, she did. Hyzenthlay was having enough trouble without her holiness.

Thuthinn...however it's spelt barely got a look in
She sings. That's about it.

Offline MeadowRabbit

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Re: WSD Mini-Series-How was it?
« Reply #24 on: December 31, 2018, 12:28:00 AM »
Spoiler: ShowHide
Couldn't even tell who sang. Couldn't tell who was who a lot of the show :D

She sings. That's about it.
Surprised they bothered to mention her then.
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Offline Carnation264

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Re: WSD Mini-Series-How was it?
« Reply #25 on: December 31, 2018, 12:28:25 AM »
Yeah I'm pretty sure we all have some problem with that, I mean first episode and I can't tell who is who. Brit had to make reference sheets just so the both of us could tell who is who.
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Offline MeadowRabbit

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Re: WSD Mini-Series-How was it?
« Reply #26 on: December 31, 2018, 12:28:53 AM »
Haha. I was sooo confused. No chance with those some of those Efrafan leaders
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Offline florapaw

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Re: WSD Mini-Series-How was it?
« Reply #27 on: December 31, 2018, 09:44:47 AM »
it’s,,,, okay. i don’t think i’d watch it a second time. it was, like, and enjoyable watch but i can’t find any motivation to rewatch, you know?

efrafa was the best part of the series honestly. it looked so cool aaaah,,,, ;;w;;

anyway my opinion is getting articulated super weirdly i think i should leave it before it gets even more convoluted

Offline Leo-rah

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Re: WSD Mini-Series-How was it?
« Reply #28 on: January 03, 2019, 01:45:06 AM »
I'm so late, since everybody yet seemed to finish the new mini series, and here I am just now, finally watched the last episode and I can join the spoilers section, without fearing about the changes they made. :3

Overall I want to say, without putting it in the spoilers:
I've absolutely fallen in love with it. I was so afraid about the animations, the music, voices. But they were all great, I gotta say, I got used to the sometimes strange animations, but in this adaption one can clearly say: That's what I've imagined as a Down! Never have I seen a more beautiful illustration of the new warren. In the 90s series, it looked so tiny e.g.
The whole environment, and everything looked so stunning.
Not just to mention the music, there were a few times, I had tears in my eyes. We may all knew what happened regarding to the story, but underlined with music, the producers were thinking of... it was so appropriate in my opinion. And I must say, I'm sad, there isn't more to watch. I'd love to see more stories/adventures after the last episode! It would be so cool. Maybe the producers consider it, if the series might get the attention.

I salute to thee, Efrafa!

Spoiler: ShowHide

The way they made Fiver's vision were so spectacular. What I loved in episode 1 especially was Silverweed and Cowslip. Both their appearances and acting were so cool, and interesting. I mean, Cowslip dancing on both his hind paws, haha. That was so great.
Oh, not to mention Bluebell playfully kissing blackberry, haha. It was so hilarious.

Episode 2 therefor, started so ineffable sad. The destruction of Sandleford was so devastating, together with the music. Brilliant work. What I thought was the most funniest part of this episode, and what really got me, was Kehaar. They really used the same German voice, as they did in the 90s series. It was so funny and memorable, hearing is voice after nearly two decades again.
They had a very interesting and stunning view on Efrafa. Kind of a castle, really amazing design in my opinion. And absolutely great, they gave some more characters a face this time. E.g. Captain Orchis... oh my,... I've absolutely fallen in love with this buck!  :orchis *coughscoughs* Seems like once again I'm preferring Efrafa more than Watership Down, hah!

That they made the Black Rabbit of Inlé a doe also wasn't a too bad choice, it was refreshing, to be honest. And an epic appearance, when it came to Hazel.

Episode 3:
Here I must say... the first questions came up to my mind. But maybe it's just me. I was wondering that a captain (Sainfoin) of the Owsla, especially in Efrafa, was able to recruite a new Owsla all on his own demand. I mean... without any further consultation with General Woundwort? o.o How insecure!
Also Campion is more different in this adaption (regarding to the older series). Kind of more diffident.

The escape also left me with several questions. They made the trick, to let the General gather all his troops. But when they leave Efrafa, it's nearly abandoned! I mean like... I would've awaited more of General Woundwort, the great fighter, thinker and strategist. At least I never would've awaited something that silly like this. But maybe I forgot something, it has been some time, since I've read the book again.

Episode 4:
Really loved that they opened us to the General's past. Really, really sad, although different. Didn't he say in a prior episode, that he's also a hutch rabbit? Also: That fox going totally rampage, what for Frith's sake! I'm not to affine with them, but wouldn't they just kill one, and leave the rest alone?
Well, as for the upcoming war...
That's what I call an epic battle! The music and scenes were so fantastic, and they even didn't spare some blood here and there. Great! Also so sad about Holly, but I'm glad they didn't make it an overall happy ending. Wouldn't have expected they would let a Watership character die. But as this is Netflix/BBC. It looked more realistic, not letting just the Efrafans die.

Overall I really love it. Although I would've loved more depth, especially on the General, there I prefer the older series version more. They focused on Woundwort's intentions, why he's acting like this, and even at some point, he was open for peace between their warrens. Here he's again just the big old monster, with the only wish to rule and kill. But all right! Great job Netflix! Great job BBC! It definitely won't be the last time I've watched it.
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Offline Chibiscuit

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Re: WSD Mini-Series-How was it?
« Reply #29 on: January 03, 2019, 04:35:16 PM »
Finally setting down my thoughts on the miniseries. Non-spoiler-y short answer would be that I enjoyed it more than I thought I would. The trailers didn't do much for me: didn't like the animation nor the music choice. I tried to keep an open mind but unintentionally my expectations weren't very high.

I have watched the miniseries twice now so you can already guess I did end up liking it!
Spoiler: ShowHide


The animation
First off, the animation didn't bother me. I was not expecting this but I'm glad. I like the backgrounds (they look flat but I like such 2D backgrounds like back in the ps1 day hah only this looked much better) and apart from the dog and fox (who were really ugly) it all looked fine to me. And everything else was overlooked as I was too preoccupied with the story and telling characters apart.

Because wow they were at times hard to distinguish and I was really trying. The Watershippers were a bit easier than the Efrafans but still it would've been nice if they'd added nametags or something. Like they do in Chinese drama and such? Add a name tag first scene a character appears each episode? But I guess they're afraid it detract from the immersion maybe?

I liked the way some shots were 'taken' like Fiver's visions, the flashback at the start of episode 4, etc. Nice.

The Lapiné

Another thing I was worried about beforehand would be the lack of Lapiné but it surprised me by using quite a bit. I loved that. For viewers unfamiliar with the book, however, it must have been confusing and I think it might have been better to add a quick translation subtitle the first time a word appears.
[I watched with Dutch subs and they simply took the Lapiné at face value. Except that time the subtitler got confused and thought 'u' was English 'you' and translated it]

The music

I'm a bit mixed on this one. On the hand, I think their music choice was very appropriate for most scenes and really added to elevate the emotion of the scene at hand. But that is as far as it reached. The music remained contained to the scene itself. I generally prefer a more thematic score where if you heard a song from it, you'd immediately associate it with this character or that moment. That is the kind of score that stays with me.

The story

It is hard not to start comparing when it comes to the story and that's not necessarily a bad thing I think and sort inevitable if it's not your first contact with WSD.

A general complain I have when it comes to the story (and its characters as well) is that at times it seemed to me that the writers forgot they added or changed something. It's as if when writing a scene they sometimes derive it from the book but forget that in their own established narrative it makes no sense. And that does bother me. More than any changes as is.
[an example: Kehaar saying he needs to find mothers too, as he had said. True. But THIS Kehaar never called does mothers nor ever mentioned that he needed to look for mothers too. The comment makes sense in book context but not in their own established narrative.]

There were a lot of changes/add-ons/left-outs I did not like actually so let's have that first:
  • The changes to the opening myth story
  • Strawberry practically digging the warren on her own and in relation to that Bigwig saying "buck can't dig". Nonono, they won't but they can.
  • Dewdrop's only purpose being to give Hazel something to yell about to Fiver at Coslip's warren and then never being mentioned again.
  • The Shape being something so natural as a crystal (it was very pretty though)
  • Bluebell not being with Holly and Holly's rather uneventful return
  • Switching the Efrafa expedition and Nuthanger raid around so that now Hazel goes to the farm before Holly leaves for Efrafa (on his own accord at that)
  • Fiver not finding Hazel in the ditch. I don't mind if Clover tagged along (in the book Blackberry goes with Fiver too so) but the fact that Fiver was not there at all? Nope.
  • Clover getting kidnapped by Efrafa
  • Changing their motivation for infiltrating Efrafa to a rescue and 'a war for taking the liberty of someone from WSD'  :snowdrop2
    Especially strange since they do earlier on recognize the need for does and wanting to get some so it's not as if they weren't going down that road anyway.
  • The Woundwort/Clover scene  :woundwort
    Mostly because of the 'queen' part. At first I thought they might be going for a connection like he briefly had with Pipkin in the TV series and that could've been potentially nice. But this was just... weird and not  like Woundwort and therefore I thought Woundwort was just messing with her head for fun.
  • The lack of escape by boat.
  • Woundwort's backstory being very lacking (as said I did like how the flashback looked, with the old film style and all)
I might be forgetting some. There are also things like Bigwig infiltrating as a storyteller that make no sense to me but that leads to one of my favourite scenes sooo.

Some changes I did like: the scene with the crows in the abandoned church. Abandoned churces are cool. Crow are cool. The scene was cool. (though again that same problem: they forgot this scene when they confronted Kehaar, not calling back to Hazel's attempts to talk to the crow). Also every scene with Orchis. The scene where Woundwort calls a guard to stop the does from singing, etc.

The characters

  • Character-wise, obviously choices had to be made. Most characters were fine to me but I absolutely hate what they did to Blackberry. Where is my smart bun? His role also got severely cut and even though the first episode makes him out to be clever, we see nothing of that in the other episodes. He's kinda forgotten ad reduced to being... ah what is a good word? an aristocrat comes to mind but that's not really right... at any rate, he's not clever anymore.
    In essence, I don't mind his character. It's just strange how they had seemingly intended for him to still be clever but then forgot? It just doesn't feel like Blackberry anymore.
  • As for Bluebell, I enjoyed him but again he didn't make that many jokes and his comic relief seems to petter out fast? I thought the scene in Cowslip's warren with Bluebell and Blackberry was amusing though I still don't like the "kissy" noises because that's just weird. Not the kissing but the noise I mean because that implies kissing as a human does and as Blackberry says, 'that is not a thing we[they/rabbits] do!' :bluebell
  • Hawkbit and Dandelion are clearly inspired by their TV series counterparts. Only less fun really. Not much to say about them. :hawkbit
  • Fiver was great. They did a good job with him I think. And his heterochromia, which I hadn't even noticed until @Chipster-roo mentioned it, looks cool now that I've taken notice of it. It's interesting that he can actively call upon his visions and that he fears them. His visions also seem to overlap at times (as with the ropes) making them unclear.
  • Hazel was okay for the most part. Except that, due to the change in motivation to infiltrate Efrafa, I don't think he appears as a good leader. I believe this was partly salvaged by leading the dog twice but such an action takes courage. Not leadership.
    Hazel is a flawed leader in the book as well and though in a different way I like that the miniseries showed this in the earlier episodes but then the only time he shows some leadership ability is when he addresses the rabbits after the escape. In everything else, he is rather underwhelming. The fact that he was putting his rabbits in danger by staying close to Efrafa because he wouldn't leave without Clover and even has that outburst: not a thing a great leader does.
  • Bigwig and Kehaar ...are Bigwig and Kehaar. I... actually don't have much to say about them. Except that I really wish their friendship was shown more because I did not get the impression they were pals.
  • Strawberry was underused and the lack of Nildro-hain took some haunting drama away. Doe or not they could have still added Nildro-hain and it would have added to the Cowslip's warren's horror I think.  As for Strawberry herself I liked her character well enough but as said: underused. It almost felt like they simply made her a doe so she could dig the warren on her own and be fought over by Hawkbit and Dandelion and that seems like such a waste.
  • Clover. What to say about Clover? I really don't like how she is so knowledgable for a hutch rabbit and I don't like her being kidnapped by Efrafa. I don't mind her becoming Hazel's mate. But overall she is portrayed as too 'holy'? And giving her the line about taking a few Efrafans down with her if she had to face  :inle-series was odd.
  • Hyzenthlay.... poor Hyzenthlay, they did not do her justice. so strange, since there was that review/interview beforehand stating how bad-ass she is but then in the miniseries... she really isn't. She doesn't come across as a leader of the does to me. Perhaps, before she was, but then we don't get to see it.
    As Orchis says, it was so very easy to break her. :hyzenthlay2
    But perhaps that is the point: this is Hyzenthlay at her breaking point. If so, it would have been nice to see at least some of what had been going on before.
  • Thethuthinnang was adorable  :thethuthinnang and again underused. She's the most loyal of the does to Hyzenthlay and she clearly is still hopeful. I would have vastly preferred it they played of her hopefulness to Hyzenthlay's growing despair instead of using Clover's naive hope.
    (on my first viewing I did not recognize the does so I couldn't say much about them so this is based on my second viewing :thethuthinnang2)
  • Nettle: first viewing = The Traitor. Didn't really distinguish her from the does beforehand.
    Second viewing= she got a lot more interesting to me :nettle
  • General Woundwort is cool-looking but severely lacking in the character and motivation department. He is also a very absent leader. Apparently the counsel usually makes all the desicions (hah does that make Vervain acting leader of Efrafa? :vervain2) and the Efrafans hardly ever see their leader.
    His motivation as far as I can see seems to be 'fear no elil; become the elil' you know not that bad of an idea for him. But again, the writers don't take this into account for most of his actions. It ties in nicely with the dog and why he wouldn't fear Kehaar but still doesn't explain why he would organize Efrafa the way it's organized. [comparison alert! In the book the organization of Efrafa does tie in with Woundwort's fear of humans and of being discovered.]
    Overall Woundwort didn't really do anything menacing here. Inlé, Vervain was doing a better job at being Woundwort than Woundwort was. (maybe Woundwort got so used to that he kinda forgot how to Woundwort himself when Vervain was no longer around to Woundwort for him)
    As mentioned, his backstory could really use more screentime as well so we understand why he found Efrafa and why these rabbits follow him.
  • Captain Vervain I mention because, you know, TV series! Vervain is my favourite. I wasn't expecting him to be like that here of course. He's like his book counterpart. His voice makes me want to play Baldur's Gate. He is Orchis' brother. I am still not over that fact. And I get the feeling that if he had lived the escape would not have been so successful. I don't know. This Vervain seems more violent than this Woundwort funny enough. And involved. I like to think he would have turned Bigwig away.
  • Captain Orchis. I save the best for last, of course. :orchis Orchis is by far my favourite character in the miniseries. I love him a lot. He is quite theatrical, loyal enough that he's one of the last two to stay by Woundwort against the dog, he is smart and doesn't trust Bigwig, he's manipulative, a tad sadistic and even has a little subplot about avenging his brother (a pity that never actually got resolved even though I thought it had during my first viewing). His voice is perfect for him and he has that laugh. Really is hyena bunny.

    Look at how cute he is too! I would willingly spy for him!
    *ahum* A-anyway, good character. Yes.

This turned out much monger than I had intended... and I know it seems that I listed more negative things than positive ones. True.
And yet still, I enjoyed the miniseries. And not just because of Orchis (it helps of course) but because most of the things I didn't like I can look past. I mean, it feels like if it were up to me, I would not have made those choices but they have been made and I can live with them. It did a lot of good too. It was entertaining. It made me cry- the ending with Hazel and Fiver, even the second time, had me in tears.

In a way my relation to the miniseries feels a bit like my relation to Kingdom Hearts: every part of Kh I'll either say 'Oh I hated this part' or 'oh that part was so annoying' or 'WHY' but in the end I own the games on their original consoles and the collections on PS3 and PS4 and I love it. :pipkin2
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