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Author Topic: Lost in Condensation?  (Read 870 times)

Offline Alderab

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Lost in Condensation?
« on: November 15, 2019, 06:16:58 AM »
There are 13 Sandleford rabbits in the novel, but the miniseries shrinks the final party down to 8:

  • Hazel
  • Fiver
  • Bigwig
  • Hawkbit
  • Blackberry
  • Bluebell
  • Dandelion
  • Captain Holly

Besides the loss of beloved names like Pipkin and Speedwell, do you think that anything was lost in condensing the cast?  Specifically, do you think there are any personality traits or group dynamics that didn't get brought over from the novel as a result of the shrink?

I think that one result from the shrunk cast is the loss of the separate faction opposing Bigwig.  In the novel, Acorn, Buckthorn, and Speedwell run into trouble with him after they threaten to return to the warren, ultimately leading to a brief fight.  Indeed, it almost seemed like there were three separate camps for a bit, with that outskirters trio tending to stick to themselves, Bigwig mostly palling around with Silver, and Hazel tending to pull the allegiance of the rest.  In the miniseries, the beginning of the story seems to have the group united under Bigwig with tepid resistance to Hazel and Fiver.
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Offline florapaw

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Re: Lost in Condensation?
« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2019, 10:15:27 PM »
The only two I’m upset about are Pipkin and Silver, because Pipkin had such a good wholesome relationship with Hazel and Silver - okay, this one is biased because I really like Silver as a background character but he was also pretty important in certain points in the novel.

I think the loss of the three different groups was a bit sad. It was nice to see that not everyone got along. It felt more believable to have everyone separated at first.

Overall I’m personally not really bothered. With the exception of Pipkin and Silver, I felt that the other rabbits were completely useless and in a novel you have time to give characters certain story arcs (like Speedwell, Acorn and Hawkbit I think it was had the one at Cowslip’s Warren where they got yelled at by Bigwig because they started complaining lmao) but with the film and miniseries, it feels more cohesive to have the group tight knit. People except there to be some less important characters in books, but if that were to happen in a film or miniseries (putting these dumb characters that don’t get any attention despite being with the main characters) people would get annoyed. Does that make sense?

Offline Chibiscuit

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Re: Lost in Condensation?
« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2019, 10:38:31 PM »
I agree with florapaw. The only ones I miss are Pipkin and Silver as well. I am pretty biased towards Silver as well. He is a great bun but not having him in, well, I can see why they'd do that. I can imagine they'd fear the audience would view him as a second, water(ship)ed down version of Bigwig (which I don't agree with as I feel Silver differs more than enough from Bigwig but with less room for showing that, I can see it being a concern)

Not including Pipkin however? Blasphemy! His relationship with Hazel in the book is the most adorable thing there is and I truly find it a loss that he and this relation weren't included.

As for the rest, whether they're there or not has little impact, I think. And it is probably better not to include them at all than to have them appear and disappear at random like in the TV series...
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Offline Alderab

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Re: Lost in Condensation?
« Reply #3 on: November 16, 2019, 09:06:37 PM »
I definitely see a case for reducing the cast when it comes to animating, each new character costs time and money to animate, voice, and place in the scene.  But it also led to some personality traits getting shifted around. 

Speaking of Pipkin, it almost seems like his lack of confidence got shifted to Hazel in the miniseries.  In the book and moreso the film, Hazel is quite straightforward and committed when making his decisions.  In the miniseries he seems more outwardly nervous, and not just in the first episode.  This leads to some scenes where every rabbits seems confident in their role as runner, storyteller, muscle, etc. while Hazel doesn't even know why he's there.  It just seemed odd to make Hazel the nervous one after Pipkin got dropped.

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Offline Acacia Heartstrings

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Re: Lost in Condensation?
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2019, 05:59:46 PM »
I definitely see a case for reducing the cast when it comes to animating, each new character costs time and money to animate, voice, and place in the scene.  But it also led to some personality traits getting shifted around. 


In terms of production, time and camera. They can only take the most relevant characters for their exposure time. Either to focus some characters for the audience and recognition or to make things easier.
I do not agree that other characters such as Silver, Speedwell, Acorn, etc. are useless. Although there are many characters, in reality each one brings their grain of sand to the plot, however little, even if they are only accompanying the main characters. It is for that reason that I can enjoy them more in books, than in audiovisual adaptations such as series and movies. Anyway, any medium has its own charm and it is good to embody the characters in each of them.
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Offline MeadowRabbit

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Re: Lost in Condensation?
« Reply #5 on: November 18, 2019, 11:34:23 PM »
I feel that Pipkin was the biggest loss here. They had trouble enough distinguishing the various rabbits as it is that if they'd added any more rabbits they would have just got rather lost in it all. Yet Pipkin I feel would have been individual enough to include, and they could have made him quite a bit younger, as in the 1999 series, to further show his vulnerability.
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Offline Kili

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Re: Lost in Condensation?
« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2020, 11:15:38 PM »
It can't be that easy trying to include all of the characters in the mini series - there aren't even enough episodes to give each character a role in the story and the realism really does make it more difficult to tell the characters apart than in the 1999 series. Leaving Pipkin out though was a mistake because he did have a lot of important scenes in the book. He also showed a side of Hazel that probably makes him a better leader than a rabbit like Bigwig would have been. In the book, Hazel cares what happens to Pipkin and sees value in him even though he's not strong and big and a good fighter like a rabbit like Bigwig is. In contrast, rabbits that show Bigwig's traits would probably have not given Pipkin a second thought.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2020, 11:18:22 PM by Kili »

Offline Alderab

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Re: Lost in Condensation?
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2020, 04:41:11 AM »
Leaving Pipkin out though was a mistake because he did have a lot of important scenes in the book. He also showed a side of Hazel that probably makes him a better leader than a rabbit like Bigwig would have been. In the book, Hazel cares what happens to Pipkin and sees value in him even though he's not strong and big and a good fighter like a rabbit like Bigwig is. In contrast, rabbits that show Bigwig's traits would probably have not given Pipkin a second thought.

This is a good point, it's definitely a group dynamic that gets lost by necessity of having less characters.  There's not really a vulnerable character in the miniseries lot to the extent that Pipkin was made out to be, even including Fiver.  There is a bigger emphasis in the series on making each rabbit have their one special thing that their good at.  That does make it easier from a storytelling perspective, and I remember my first time watching the miniseries being grateful that I could link that character as the runner and this character as the fighter.  But at the same time, it's not very realistic, and now that I know the story better I think I'd like a greater variety.  The book seems to handle varying the skill spread, where some rabbits like Dandelion had a few things he excelled at, while having others like Hawkbit who never really had an overarching skill.

But all in all, it is interesting to see how Hazel shines in making sure that no one is left behind.
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